front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

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Dennis Nicholas
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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Sat Sep 12, 2020 6:10 pm

GTC 1980 with power steering. (but believe applies to all SE6 onwards)
Just overhauling offside suspension. (N/S done with no real hitches).
Found lower front wishbone bracket a bit loose in chassis....mostly bottom stud. Very difficult access but managed to get socket on nut with shortish extension but unable to apply enough muscle power to slacken or tighten nut (Nyloc?). Ratchet handle about 6 inches long and difficult to hold extension to stop slipping off nut.

What tips to help get it off/tightened (am spraying with a releasing/anticorrosion fluid. Following are thoughts:-

1.Remove radiator for extra room and also move steering rack.
2.To get more access - remove 4 bolts holding down steering rack to allow it to be moved forward to where radiator was ( is it just 4 bolts and release steering column 4 bolts at the disc half way up?).
3. Is it better, and is it possible to grind the heads of the studs off the outside so bracket can be taken off and remainder of studs just dropped into the under tray? Fitting new bracket should not be so difficult with nice new threads and nuts requiring less effort to do up.
4. Even thinking cut access hole in under tray and weld back when finished?? (have local friend good welder......would not try with my welding.)
5. I have one of those induction heater tools but think the access is too difficult to get coil properly round nuts (which you can't see for positioning)

I thought I was just going to clean up the chassis and brackets today and paint (POR 15) like I did the other side. All the bits have been cleaned, soaked in Bilt Hamber's deox C to remove corrosion and given 2 coats Hydrate 80 ready for applying the POR 15. (I still can't get any of the more superior KBS Coatings Rust Seal in UK) (lets hope after BREXIT finally completed we can trade more easily with USA and someone in UK will again import the stuff). AJL??? Tried to get Holden to ditch POR and go for KBS but no go.

So is it option 1 and 2 or will that still not give enough room or will option 3 be better/possible?

Depressed Dennis. (Off to watch the F1 qually now)


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peter freeman
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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by peter freeman » Sat Sep 12, 2020 7:20 pm

I would cut it off and fit a new bracket



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Terry Rickard
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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by Terry Rickard » Sat Sep 12, 2020 7:23 pm

I had to remove radiator for better access and would recomend you do the same.



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scimjim
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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by scimjim » Sat Sep 12, 2020 8:40 pm

Yep, removing rad will make refitting a lot easier too.


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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by JoeySully » Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:21 pm

Yes its quite difficult without removing the radiator. The stud could also be rotating in the bracket if the welds have failed like mine had.. took me several hours to figure that out..
For ultimate access remove bumper and anti roll bar.



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Dennis Nicholas
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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Mon Sep 14, 2020 10:40 am

Thanks all.
Drained yesterday...fast at first then slow trickle left to empty overnight. Rad coming out today - nice to feel the bolts easy to remove after previous refurbish work and coppaslip treatment.


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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Mon Sep 14, 2020 8:12 pm

Radiator out, and still not really enough room to work (and still no luck moving bottom nut with socket and ratchet) So out with spare wheel tray - nice and easy as 4 bolts freely undid from their captive nuts. Decided fan blades looking vulnerable so off with fan - two 7/16 bolts with nuts through small box crossmember and just put out of way in nose-piece. Thats better! 1/2 socket with extension and long handled universal joint leaver (wreckers bar?) - bit of wood under extensions to stop them moving downwards and letting socket slip off nut - - heave!, top nut has moved ok, on to bottom - Snick, thats got it, nut turning......oh so is round flat head of stud in bracket!!!
JoeySulley......just what you had happen. How did you get over it? I see 3 actions:-
1. Mig weld head back to bracket with a couple of spots. But would I still be unable to move nut? Battery disconnected but is this likely to do any damage to the electronic module? (GTC)
2. Drill round flat head of stud -----how thick is that head---don't want to risk damage to chassis.
3. Grind off round flat head and the plate it should be attached to. Ditto thickness before stud would be free to push through chassis?

I noted there is a tube spacer/strengthener between the chassis sides where the studs go through

The bracket is actually in an otherwise good condition but 2 new ones on order coming tomorrow from QRG.

Now retired hurt and with sore arm muscles.

Dennis


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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by JoeySully » Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:24 pm

I mig welded the stud back onto the bracket to stop it rotating. My first welding job ever in fact. I doubt it will damage anything electrical but worth removing battery. You could drill it too, soft enough steel. The stud head was not that thick if i recall but not enough to grab with a vice grips. You could get an angle grinder in there if you have a medium sized one but lots of sparks.

You may fit an air impact gun in the narrow space between the radiator and steering rack using 2-3 extension bars with a flexible joint between them to remove the nut. My ratchet would only move one click and not enough space to get any leverage.

I ended up stripping down the whole front end afterwards so re-assembly was easier. :roll:
20190112_112818.jpg
20190112_112818.jpg (219.39 KiB) Viewed 337 times



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Dennis Nicholas
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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:57 am

I may be a bit delayed giving any further info on this job as I seem to have sprained my arm. I can't even pick up a pint mug from the table beside me and lift it to my lips :cry: :cry:
However might be able to operate a paint brush and at last paint the underbody of the Austin.......at the same time was hoping to do all the Scim suspension bits and some chassis areas. Don't think I could even hold a hub for painting.........ok you can put the violins away now.

Dennis


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Old and Slow
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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by Old and Slow » Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:05 pm

Is it possible to "jam" the bolt to prevent it turning by putting a jack under the bracket and relying on the weight of the car on the chassis to hold it?


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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by efi_sprintgte » Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:44 pm

Weld a nut onto the spinning stud head then you can undo it from the easy access side?


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Dennis Nicholas
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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:48 pm

Old and Slow wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:05 pm
Is it possible to "jam" the bolt to prevent it turning by putting a jack under the bracket and relying on the weight of the car on the chassis to hold it?
Unlikely as top stud is still welded to bracket and would probably take some of the weight. But thanks.
efi_sprintgte wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:44 pm
Weld a nut onto the spinning stud head then you can undo it from the easy access side?
Was going to mig weld head to bracket but that sounds good idea to have nut on outside with socket/ratchet inside jammed in place so can turn from the outside in a more comfortable position.....arm still sore today so no further work.
Thanks muchly for that idea.


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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Sun Sep 20, 2020 11:14 am

SUCCESS
Here is series of photos showing what I did and what I found out.

Round thin stud head MIG welded with bracket in situ on car.
DSCF1324.jpeg
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Radiator removed, spare wheel tray removed and fan undone and laid in nosepiece out the way. Small flat piece of wood 7/8 inch thick X 5.25" wide X 9" long placed on under tray to support socket and ratchet handle to stop socket from going at angle and twisting off nut. Obviously thicker block for top nut.
No hope of undoing with just ratchet handle and socket on the 3/8 UNF, 9/16 AF nut.
DSCF1321.jpeg
DSCF1321.jpeg (252.85 KiB) Viewed 164 times

2 foot steel tube over ratchet handle and success but only able to turn 2 clicks at a time even with all that space.
DSCF1322.jpeg
DSCF1322.jpeg (281.47 KiB) Viewed 164 times
Tried air hammer gun but socket just kept turning off nut which was found to have a rather thin head.
DSCF1323.jpeg
DSCF1323.jpeg (203.33 KiB) Viewed 164 times
More to follow.

Dennis


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front bracket - lower wishbone to chassis O/S removal

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Sun Sep 20, 2020 5:54 pm

The rear bracket also welded on stud head.
DSCF1325.jpeg
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This shows the thin head of the stud that goes through the chassis.
DSCF1320.jpeg
DSCF1320.jpeg (117.2 KiB) Viewed 121 times
This shows the splines on the stud through the bracket.
DSCF1319.jpeg
DSCF1319.jpeg (149.17 KiB) Viewed 121 times
One new bracket beside an obviously refurbed one with round flat headed stud replaced with a hex head bolt. All brackets now have heads spot welded to bracket.
DSCF1318.jpeg
DSCF1318.jpeg (230.93 KiB) Viewed 121 times


For those new to Scimitars you will notice that the heads are welded to what seems to be an afterthought thickish plate sitting on and welded to the bracket; earlier brackets were found to fracture so were strengthened for later production.

Dennis


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1980 GTC Trafalgar Blue, 2010 basic Skoda Yeti (petrol), Austin 7s, Rileys.

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