Sabre 1400 just added

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Sabre 1400 just added

Post by Supersub » Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:59 pm

Update on the starter motor.

Having passed on the info to Oxbys that Jim supplied had a call from Leigh lunchtime with good news. Having stripped the motor off he found that when he connected it to a battery the starter drive gear was very sluggish in its movement. He found the joints connecting the fork from the solenoid to the drive gear dry and stiff. A good clean and lubricated it work perfectly when testing it again on the battery. Fitted back on the car it worked fine. He said he tried it about twenty times with no probs. Great. He arranged to pick me up and take me to his garage. Upon arrival he took me out to the car turned the key and guess what. You guessed it. A screech from the starter as it didn't engage. You should have seen his face. Anyway a couple of more attempts and it started. Turning off he tried again. A screech. Oh the joys of Reliant ownership! Back to square one.

Anyway call from Leigh late this afternoon. Having tried his local motor factors one said that part no. LRS543 equates to that used on a Sierra. He didn't have any stock whilst the other motor factor said it had been discontinued. In light of this Leigh suggested I get the unit refurbed. Since this was a refurbed one I was a bit hesitant but Leigh has assured me that this guy is good. Been in the business a long time. Even if he cannot rebuild it Leigh feels he can probably locate one. So the plan is to get the starter back off and me to take it over to Spilsby next week. Fingers crossed won't be too long before the cars back on the road.

Will let you know how I get on. In the meantime can anyone tell me why Reliant didn't just use the standard one that Rover fitted to their 1.4 cars?

Mike


Mike Storey
1996 1.4 K Series Sabre
1996 Nissan QX 3.0ltr SEL
1995 Quantum 1.9ltr 2+2
2004 Mondeo MKIII 130TDCi Estate
Previous: -1990 SST 1800Ti, 1993 Sabre 1400, 1992 Sabre 1400 (based on 1991 SST), 1972 se5a gte, 1968 SE4b Coupe

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Post by scimjim » Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:34 pm

Because the Rover was front wheel drive.

It did also say Sierra in the link :D


Jim King

SECURE DRY STORAGE FOR YOUR SCIMITAR

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Sabre 1400 just added

Post by Supersub » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:07 pm

Didn't know that front wheel drive would make a difference.

Did take note of that Jim. Just saying that they confirmed it.

Thanks again

Mike


Mike Storey
1996 1.4 K Series Sabre
1996 Nissan QX 3.0ltr SEL
1995 Quantum 1.9ltr 2+2
2004 Mondeo MKIII 130TDCi Estate
Previous: -1990 SST 1800Ti, 1993 Sabre 1400, 1992 Sabre 1400 (based on 1991 SST), 1972 se5a gte, 1968 SE4b Coupe

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Sabre 1400 just added

Post by philhoward » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:34 pm

Starter motor bolts onto the gearbox - and it’s not a Rover gearbox. Strictly speaking it bolts to the Caterham bellhousing so its their fault..


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Post by scimjim » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:45 pm

Probably made sense to use a Sierra starter when they were prolific :D


Jim King

SECURE DRY STORAGE FOR YOUR SCIMITAR

Current: SE5 (8Ball), TI SS1 (snotty), 1600 SS1 (G97), 1600 SS1 (C686CCR), 2.5TD SE5a (diesel 5a), 6 x random other SS1s.
Previous: SE5, 3 x SE5a, 2 x SE6a, 3 x SE6b, GTC, 2.9i GTC, 3 x 1600 SS1, 1300 SS1, Mk1 Ti Sabre, Mk1.5 CVH Sabre
Chief mechanic for: 1400 K series SS1 (Megan3), 1400 CVH EFi SS1 (Grawpy), 1300 SS1 (Number One) & Sarah's coupe.
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Sabre 1400 just added

Post by philhoward » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:54 pm

There are 2 non-interchangeable Sierra units - I’m guessing the 543 is the DOHC/CVH Sierra one (as is fitted to G97 at the moment?

Difference is the throw of the gear - basically where the ring gear is in relation to the rear engine face.


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Sabre 1400 just added

Post by Supersub » Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:14 pm

Latest on the the Starter Motor fiasco

Picked it up from Oxby's today to take it to be refurbished. However before doing so thought I would have a look at it myself. Connected it to a battery and the drive gear throws to its full travel no problem. However a closer look at the gear and the cause was obvious. If you look at the pics attached it can be clearly seen that even on full travel the drive gear is only engaging on the first 2 or 3mm of the gear. Hence the screeching when it sometimes fails to engage with the flywheel. A quick visit and chat with John Skuse who was going to rebuild it for me confirmed that was was the cause. Conclusion was that someone had fitted the wrong starter to the car. I wonder who that was?
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Jim can you have a look at yours on the shelf and compare the measurements with those I have shown on the attached starter diagram. The drawing is just an illustration and not of the one fitted. I used this just to indicate the approximate size of this one. Obviously if you confirm my suspicions I will be looking for a replacement.
My starter motor.JPG
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Diagram 1.JPG
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Many thanks.

Mike


Mike Storey
1996 1.4 K Series Sabre
1996 Nissan QX 3.0ltr SEL
1995 Quantum 1.9ltr 2+2
2004 Mondeo MKIII 130TDCi Estate
Previous: -1990 SST 1800Ti, 1993 Sabre 1400, 1992 Sabre 1400 (based on 1991 SST), 1972 se5a gte, 1968 SE4b Coupe

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Sabre 1400 just added

Post by reliant-reviver » Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:42 am

Have a look on this thread which I don't think had been linked yet.

viewtopic.php?f=61&t=18801&p=212682


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Post by scimjim » Tue Jun 25, 2019 8:36 am

reliant-reviver wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:42 am
Have a look on this thread which I don't think had been linked yet.

viewtopic.php?f=61&t=18801&p=212682
that thread is referenced and linked to the thread I linked :D


Jim King

SECURE DRY STORAGE FOR YOUR SCIMITAR

Current: SE5 (8Ball), TI SS1 (snotty), 1600 SS1 (G97), 1600 SS1 (C686CCR), 2.5TD SE5a (diesel 5a), 6 x random other SS1s.
Previous: SE5, 3 x SE5a, 2 x SE6a, 3 x SE6b, GTC, 2.9i GTC, 3 x 1600 SS1, 1300 SS1, Mk1 Ti Sabre, Mk1.5 CVH Sabre
Chief mechanic for: 1400 K series SS1 (Megan3), 1400 CVH EFi SS1 (Grawpy), 1300 SS1 (Number One) & Sarah's coupe.
CURE THE FAULT - NOT THE SYMPTOMS

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Sabre 1400 just added

Post by reliant-reviver » Tue Jun 25, 2019 8:41 am

Navigating the rabbit hole. It's all here somewhere!


Philip Andrew.
'74 Robin Super Saloon, '84 SS1 1300, '86 SS1 1800ti, '87 SS1 1300
Previous: I lost count around fifty.

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Post by Supersub » Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:28 am

Your right there Phil. You just need to know your way around the warren. Anyway thanks for looking but as Jim said he had already supplied that link. I'm pretty sure that once Jim checks his one on the shelf against the measurements of mine I will be hunting round for one. If it was CVH no doubt you like Jim would have one squirrelled away in your parts store.


Mike Storey
1996 1.4 K Series Sabre
1996 Nissan QX 3.0ltr SEL
1995 Quantum 1.9ltr 2+2
2004 Mondeo MKIII 130TDCi Estate
Previous: -1990 SST 1800Ti, 1993 Sabre 1400, 1992 Sabre 1400 (based on 1991 SST), 1972 se5a gte, 1968 SE4b Coupe

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Post by scimjim » Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:08 pm

Okay - photos below. Measurements are:

Full length = 220mm against your 200
Motor body = 142mm against your 136
Nose dia = 60mm

I’m not sure if they are the most important dimensions though? The ring gear meshing is decided by the full nose length minus the spacer plate - also length of starter teeth (which look very different on mine?)
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Jim King

SECURE DRY STORAGE FOR YOUR SCIMITAR

Current: SE5 (8Ball), TI SS1 (snotty), 1600 SS1 (G97), 1600 SS1 (C686CCR), 2.5TD SE5a (diesel 5a), 6 x random other SS1s.
Previous: SE5, 3 x SE5a, 2 x SE6a, 3 x SE6b, GTC, 2.9i GTC, 3 x 1600 SS1, 1300 SS1, Mk1 Ti Sabre, Mk1.5 CVH Sabre
Chief mechanic for: 1400 K series SS1 (Megan3), 1400 CVH EFi SS1 (Grawpy), 1300 SS1 (Number One) & Sarah's coupe.
CURE THE FAULT - NOT THE SYMPTOMS

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reliant-reviver
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Sabre 1400 just added

Post by reliant-reviver » Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:51 pm

How many teeth on the meshing gear? I have a couple of unknowns and recall they have a different number.


Philip Andrew.
'74 Robin Super Saloon, '84 SS1 1300, '86 SS1 1800ti, '87 SS1 1300
Previous: I lost count around fifty.

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scimjim
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Post by scimjim » Tue Jun 25, 2019 1:07 pm

10


Jim King

SECURE DRY STORAGE FOR YOUR SCIMITAR

Current: SE5 (8Ball), TI SS1 (snotty), 1600 SS1 (G97), 1600 SS1 (C686CCR), 2.5TD SE5a (diesel 5a), 6 x random other SS1s.
Previous: SE5, 3 x SE5a, 2 x SE6a, 3 x SE6b, GTC, 2.9i GTC, 3 x 1600 SS1, 1300 SS1, Mk1 Ti Sabre, Mk1.5 CVH Sabre
Chief mechanic for: 1400 K series SS1 (Megan3), 1400 CVH EFi SS1 (Grawpy), 1300 SS1 (Number One) & Sarah's coupe.
CURE THE FAULT - NOT THE SYMPTOMS

Supersub
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Sabre 1400 just added

Post by Supersub » Tue Jun 25, 2019 1:22 pm

Thanks Jim. I think you are right about overall measurements not being so relevant as the full nose length. Will check mine against your measurements later and let you know what I find. Will also check number of teeth on the drive gear.


Mike Storey
1996 1.4 K Series Sabre
1996 Nissan QX 3.0ltr SEL
1995 Quantum 1.9ltr 2+2
2004 Mondeo MKIII 130TDCi Estate
Previous: -1990 SST 1800Ti, 1993 Sabre 1400, 1992 Sabre 1400 (based on 1991 SST), 1972 se5a gte, 1968 SE4b Coupe

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