Electric window winders

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Peter S
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Electric window winders

Post by Peter S » Wed Dec 18, 2019 12:02 pm

All this information leaves me with a dilemma :? I have just taken out the driver's side window mechanism as it was disconnected 1/2 up. It's the CIM type. It did work a little bit before stalling and smelling however the felt runner was very distorted, but worked up with assistance.
Now it's out of the car it works :!: But no load, however the replacement which came with the car is unmarked but has locking nuts not rivets and may not fit through the opening. It also works ( with no load).
Is there a way of establishing which is best :!:
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Peter S
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Post by peter freeman » Wed Dec 18, 2019 1:21 pm

Try putting a bit of load on them to find out which one deals with it best. I found the earlier motors I could take apart to clean the commutator and free if not replace the brushes- the later motors I could not take apart so easily but I drilled a hole in the gearbox end and filled the GB with silicone grease which got them working better



drcdb15
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Electric window winders

Post by drcdb15 » Wed Dec 18, 2019 3:07 pm

Terry Rickard wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 10:46 am
The Rover SD1 rear electric window winder assembly units do fit the SE6-series, GTC and I believe Middlebridge IF the right-angled link plate piece is transferred from old unit to new rear unit.
Ask me how I know...
I'm more interested in what you had to do to find out - which piece exactly?
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Chris
MB61; formerly 1978 SE6A 3.5 V8; 1986 SE6B 2.9 EFi.

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Terry Rickard
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Post by Terry Rickard » Wed Dec 18, 2019 3:31 pm

Hi Chris,
The only difference between the units in the upper and lower photos is the right-angled link plate piece in the upper photo of a front mechanism plus the position of the bent tooth stops.
In the lower photo (of a rear unit) disconnect the end of the straight link (that joins the toothed segment to the wider arm) from the wider arm end (with the white writing on in the lower photo).
Remove the right-angled link plate piece (shown in the upper photo) and connect and fix in place (rivet or weld; ensuring that what needs to pivot still does) between the free end of the straight link and the wider arm.
As the bent tooth stop is in a different place then it has to be bent flat and another stop created further round in the corresponding place on the (now converted) rear unit by making two saw cuts and bending the two teeth up.
Regards,
Terry



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Post by drcdb15 » Wed Dec 18, 2019 6:50 pm

Thanks Terry, that sounds quite do-able. Will 'ordinary' pop rivets be adequate for re-fixing? I'm guessing the smart way to do this is to remove both old units and lay them out as mirror images. Then work on one, using the other as a template to get the gear engagement on the correct teeth so that the stop positions (closed/open) are correct. Probably take a few photos too to be on the safe side. Is there a best starting point for this, for example, with the old unit in the fully up/fully down/mid-way position, or does it not matter because you can re-position the gear quadrant on the screw quite easily? And just to be sure, is the "right-angled link plate piece" the part arrowed here:
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Thanks


Chris
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Terry Rickard
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Post by Terry Rickard » Thu Dec 19, 2019 8:06 pm

Hi Chris,
I don’t think ordinary pop-rivets would be adequate going by the size of the originals. I carefully trimmed the old rivets where they had been formed with a ‘big +’ them reused them and had just the one side welded to replace the trimmed off ‘big +’ deformed area.
Yes, best to lay units side by side and work on one at a time and take photos, although it will be quite obvious as you work with them.
Probably best to start with the wider arm pretty much in line with the motor, so not far off as shown in your photo, but you may have to change that as required to get at the rivets.
You should not have to realign the teeth on the driven pinion or the quadrat as they should not be disturbed – all you want to do is remove the ‘right-angled link plate piece’ and transfer to the other unit.
Yes, the ‘right-angled link plate piece’ is as arrowed in your photo.
Regards,
Terry



drcdb15
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Post by drcdb15 » Thu Dec 19, 2019 8:57 pm

Terry Rickard wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 8:06 pm
Hi Chris,
I don’t think ordinary pop-rivets would be adequate going by the size of the originals. I carefully trimmed the old rivets where they had been formed with a ‘big +’ them reused them and had just the one side welded to replace the trimmed off ‘big +’ deformed area.
Thanks for that information. Not having welding gear or easy access to it, perhaps a thin-head cap screw like this would suffice, with a lock washer and similarly thin nut. Are there any particularly critical clearances where this might pose a problem ?
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Chris
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Terry Rickard
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Post by Terry Rickard » Thu Dec 19, 2019 9:25 pm

They look like they could work, but might be easier to take the units somewhere for welding.
I don't think there are any critical clearances - if the units fit in and work without anything hitting then job done.



drcdb15
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Post by drcdb15 » Thu Dec 19, 2019 11:22 pm

Many thanks for all your advice Terry, much appreciated, and not forgetting other contributors to this thread, especially Dennis' OP for alerting us to this opportunity.


Chris
MB61; formerly 1978 SE6A 3.5 V8; 1986 SE6B 2.9 EFi.

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Post by gtcse8 » Fri Dec 20, 2019 8:42 am

I have a few Units without motors but Good teeth and little wear that I have replaced over the years when the motors failed.
Still looking for a source of just the motors to repair these units, but Rimmers tell me they are unobtainable.

If anyone has a damaged/worn mechanical part they can have the units at £10 + p&p ?.

I also have a set of Mechanical winders Brand New that I will never get round to using if anyone was interested. ?. :wink:


Mark Wilson. Garage sale everything must go. :cry:1 SE6b, 1 GTC Shell &1 SE6a shell & a Triumph Daytona. Also on YouTube :wink: lookup V8 Chevy https://youtu.be/lbpvDGAMY6g https://youtu.be/7xTrbr0ETSA https://youtu.be/K7HfYVd5Flo

Peter S
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Electric window winders

Post by Peter S » Sun Dec 22, 2019 5:31 pm

For future reference. I load tested both of my SS1 lift motors. They both sounded to be straining with a load on the end of the main bar of 10kgs ( actually an old brake caliper and disc and 5 litres of oil 8)) but worked OK. As the glass with metal channels attached weight just under 3 kgs I'm minded to stick with the one I took out, the CIM one as I know it fits. I think the rear felt was jamming it, which I have replaced + the alignment probably needs sorting.


Peter S
I'm back - with a SS1 1800? project

drcdb15
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Electric window winders

Post by drcdb15 » Sun Dec 22, 2019 11:30 pm

Peter S wrote:
Sun Dec 22, 2019 5:31 pm
I think the rear felt was jamming it, which I have replaced + the alignment probably needs sorting.
Also worth lubricating with graphite (thanks to Pete Freeman for this tip, though I expect it's one of those things that everybody knew except me :roll: )

https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/Kasp-K30050-Gr ... gLhpvD_BwE


Chris
MB61; formerly 1978 SE6A 3.5 V8; 1986 SE6B 2.9 EFi.

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