GTC front suspension vertical links

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Dennis Nicholas
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GTC front suspension vertical links

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Wed May 22, 2019 10:35 pm

Continued overhaul of N/S suspension (PORT side). Slow progress due to trying to take it easy after 2 hip replacements in last 6 months. So more time assessing than doing as it is all still a bit sore at times.
I see from the Reliant Parts list that the vertical links are handed....so what makes them handed?
Also in the list there are 4 different part numbers......what are the differences?
211185 RH 211186 LH
216818 RH 216819 LH

I have 4 spare V L 3 new and one is obviously a used. 1 LH + 2 RH
A difference is the shoulder at the bottom that the spacer fits over (spacer between felt seal and VL) on 3 new it is deeper than on old one.
Spacer is the ring standing up in the picture.....were there more than one versions of depth?
Scimitar 6a front hub oil seal 3.jpg
Scimitar 6a front hub oil seal 3.jpg (228.82 KiB) Viewed 517 times
Will try and get out tomorrow to strip hub and bits from LH vert link (passenger side....port side)to see what I have fitted.
Last edited by Dennis Nicholas on Sat May 25, 2019 11:19 am, edited 1 time in total.


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Post by JoeySully » Thu May 23, 2019 7:13 am

The casting nubmer are the same on all of them. The thread for the trunnion makes tgem handed.

I good way to check if they are not bent is to fit them to a trrunnion and rotate left and right with the handle of a socket wrench in the top ball joint hole. While rotating there should be no movement of the ratchet handle. The trunnion and bsll joint move in the same plane.



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GTC front suspension vertical links

Post by scimjim » Thu May 23, 2019 7:19 am

As you pointed out Dennis, there is a raised shoulder on one version (can’t remember if it’s early or late but it’s been discussed a few times).


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Post by JoeySully » Thu May 23, 2019 7:19 am

I purchased a wheel bearing that came with the thicker felt oil seal. It made the diske sit out further than it should and i had to revert to the old ones. Bearing were the same.
Im not sure if there were different ones but i do recall a thread on this topic before. They may off something other than a scimitar



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GTC front suspension vertical links

Post by Roger Pennington » Thu May 23, 2019 1:06 pm

Yes, I'd agree with Jim, you (Dennis) made the point in a previous note that, IIRC, the earlier uprights took the separate spacer ring as illustrated, and later ones has it machined into the upright. (I think - I can't actually find the ref. the nearest I can get is this post - perhaps it was on Yahoo?)

As a further note, don't throw away the old metal holder for the felt seal, until you've tried to fit the new one - I've had some which appeared to be slightly oversize and wouldn't fit in the hub, so I had to re-use the old metal cup with the new felt.


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Post by Dennis Nicholas » Sat May 25, 2019 11:15 am

Roger Pennington wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 1:06 pm
Yes, I'd agree with Jim, you (Dennis) made the point in a previous note that, IIRC, the earlier uprights took the separate spacer ring as illustrated, and later ones has it machined into the upright. (I think - I can't actually find the ref. the nearest I can get is this post - perhaps it was on Yahoo?)

As a further note, don't throw away the old metal holder for the felt seal, until you've tried to fit the new one - I've had some which appeared to be slightly oversize and wouldn't fit in the hub, so I had to re-use the old metal cup with the new felt.
Roger. Yes that was the original discussion and I have even managed to find the pictures on the Yahoo groups (stupidly I do not seem to have saved them anywhere on either of my computers....now done so)

Here is original description I made:-

have a look at yahoo groups reliant scimitar photos....photo album - 6a front hub seals. Picture DSCF0034 shows the components in the order that they go together on the front O/S.
The smallest ring with the recess you can see goes onto the stub axle and the recess fits over the protruding sholder on the vertical link.
The largest ring on the right fits into the hub casing with the face you can see facing away from the hub.
The middle ring is the felt seal that goes around the little ring and inside the larger ring (soak felt in an oil containing Molyslip.
The large ring is an interference fit into the hub so it stays stationary in the hub.
The small ring is a slight interference fit on the stub so stays stationary.
The felt is free to rotate round small and inside large rings.

And here are the other two pictures
spacer-felt-cup .jpeg
spacer-felt-cup .jpeg (86.34 KiB) Viewed 409 times
Spacer felt seal felt side.jpeg
Spacer felt seal felt side.jpeg (75.12 KiB) Viewed 409 times
These were from my 1976 GTE (a problem arose when I could not centre the calliper on one side and found a previous owner had put the spacer in back to front so it was not sitting over the Vert. Link shoulder and thus the hub was too far out from the link!!!)

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GTC front suspension vertical links

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Mon May 27, 2019 2:04 am

Further progress.
There would appear to have been more than one type of Vertical Link (the Reliant SE6 Parts List R part No.91603. Overdrive and Automatic models introduced October 1975 from Chassis Number 5J48/18201001.) is not too helpful and can be a bit confusing I find.

First a conflict of terms....taper bearings....the inner race is the cone and the outer is the cup (NTN definitions).
This is not to be confused with the Reliant description "cup, inner bearing" item 13 on Fig3 in the workshop manual R part number 91602, 1978.

"cup, inner bearing" is what we have been referring to as the spacer around which the felt seal sits...the first ring in the photo which was said to sit over the shoulder on the Vert. Link.
That was applicable to my 1976 SE6a....BUT I now see that (probably )from the introduction of the 6b/SE8 the shoulder on the Vert. Link is larger diameter and there is no "cup, inner bearing" the felt seal fits over this larger shoulder. The picture below shows the dimensions of the shoulders of this (later?) Vert Link as I have measured on my 1980 GTC and on 3 other new Links I have. The light dawned when I measured a used Vert. Link I also have and found the shoulder to have smaller dia. and the "cup, inner bearing" I have spare fitted over it.
SCN_0004.jpg
SCN_0004.jpg (221.95 KiB) Viewed 367 times
HOWEVER further confusion over the "oil seal assembly" which in the Fig 3 of workshop manual is item 14 which in turn is made up of felt seal 15 and an unnumbered steel cup (numbered 27 in GW parts catalogue 2nd edition).

I have found 3 different versions in my spares box see photos below.
DSCF1063.JPG
DSCF1063.JPG (236.39 KiB) Viewed 367 times
DSCF1064.JPG
DSCF1064.JPG (244.55 KiB) Viewed 367 times
DSCF1065.JPG
DSCF1065.JPG (238.23 KiB) Viewed 367 times
From left to right it can be seen that all are different thickness.
No. 1 is an old used item and the other two are new. No 1 would be a tight push fit into the hub. using a digital calliper I get:
old hub I/D 2.0860
seal 1 O/D 2.0875 and I/D of felt fits over Vert link shoulder
seal 2 O/D 2.1080 so would be struggle to fit in hub?? I/D of felt fits over VL shoulder.
seal 3 O/D 2.0965 probably fit in hub ?? BUT I/D of felt too small to fit over shoulder (think this would fit over shoulder of old VL without "cup, inner bearing") . The felts of 2 and 3 are actually stuck into their cups
The faces of the felt cup that go next to the roller bearing are all slightly different as can be seen from photo 3:-
1 slightly dished away from bearing from outside to I/D; 2 completely flat; 3 being wider has more noticeable dish.
This inner surface needs to be slightly dished away from the bearing cone since the cone is stationary on the axle while the felt cup is rotating with the hub so the felt cup needs to be clear of the bearing cone and the rollers.
This should be an easy job :cry:

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GTC front suspension vertical links

Post by Dennis Nicholas » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:44 pm

Joey Sulley....ref felt seal being too thick.....who did it come from?

To All....any answers/thoughts about felt seals 1,2,3 in pics above?? Especially 3.

Have just received parcels from GW and QR.
GW felt seals just like No. 3 picture....very thick and Internal diameter too small to fit over vertical link shoulder....could they be for 5/5a? Will be calling them tomorrow.

QR will only do front hub bearing KIT = 2 bearings + felt seal in metal cup + split pin + sachet of bearing grease.
Felt seal is nearly same as No 1 in picture BUT even less felt thickness...at least they fit over shoulder of later Vertical link!
Looks like I may just use the old felts/cup....all nicely soaked in Moly already.

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Post by JoeySully » Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:28 am

I got it from http://www.mevspares.co.uk/search.php?m ... rch&page=1

But ordered over the phone.



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