Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

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Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by Corky » Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:36 pm

I'm just trying to work out the best way to convert the twin line feeds to the calipers on my SS1 race car build, to single line.

I want make sure that I don't upset the balance and I don't turn the system into the equivalent of a single system similar to what would be found on a Coupe/SE5 etc. i.e. one feed to all wheels.

A few of ideas spring to mind.

1) Add a Y piece to the pair of feeds to each front caliper. This would be easy and would still give a supply from both the front and rear chambers of the master cylinder.

2) Block off the two outlets to the calipers on the 4 way coupling (shown as no.6 on the drawing). This would make the front chamber feed the calipers and the rear chamber feed the cylinders. I'm worried this will upset the balance. Maybe the way to balance the brakes is just to play around with wheel cylinder sizes ?

3) Replicate the layout of the system from the 6A by adding a brake balance valve assembly (I just happen to have one on the shelf from a 6B)

4) Ditch the master cylinder and replace with twin master cylinders and a balance bar. This would be the last resort as I want to be able to MOT the car for the first couple of years.

Image

Edit:- SE6A/B system for comparison. Note the balance valve.

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Last edited by Corky on Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by reliant-reviver » Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:42 pm

On the single line Gottfried Burkhardt system i have pipes 13 and 12 are dispensed with and blocked at the 4 way. Gained TUV technical approval so can't be all that lethal!


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by Corky » Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:43 pm

I assume you didn't have any balance issues Phil ?


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by CNHSS1 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:50 pm

As R-R both mine have had 12 & 13 removed and the 4 way blocked off.
There should be no difference to balance if the front called sizes are the same as OEM, but I believe your callers are different so the balance will be different but this won't be due to single line mod


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by Corky » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:06 pm

Ok thanks fellas. I'll block those two feeds. Good to know it's worked ok for others.


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by Corky » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:07 pm

Mods. Is this worth a sticky? May be of use to others ?


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by scimjim » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:09 pm

I've blocked the 4 way Union on the flying broomstick too.


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by Corky » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:15 pm

Cheers Jim.


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by richardvernon » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:28 pm

Corky wrote:
A few of ideas spring to mind.

1) Add a Y piece to the pair of feeds to each front caliper. This would be easy and would still give a supply from both the front and rear chambers of the master cylinder
While I think it would work OK , in the event of a m/cylinder seal failure I suspect you might lose brakes completely.Fluid pressure would be lost because of back flow via the -now- linked m/cylinder chambers.

Saying that, not sure if a split brake circuit is a requirement for non- road going sprinters?

Edit: but might be handy to avoid underpant related issue :lol:


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by philhoward » Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:01 pm

Stickied.

I do recall us giving this a lot of thinking time and always coming to the same answer as above.

Front/rear balance is pretty easy to tweak given the amount of rear wheel cylinder sizes available.


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by Corky » Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:22 am

Thanks Phil.

After a bit more thinking (dangerous I know), I've decided to eliminate the 4 port block altogether and run a single line from the master cylinder to the splitter at the rear. I've got it in my head that four extra couplings are four extra failure points.

Furthermore, as I'm using a 22mm master cylinder (Internally identical to those in the 6A) I've decided to swap the lines over. So the rear brakes will be fed from the secondary piston and the fronts from the primary piston as in the 6A/B/GTC. I did read a technical explanation for this design a few years ago, but can't find it to link to.


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by reliant-reviver » Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:34 pm

Sounds sound to me.

I was planning on doing similar but hadn't considered swapping the lines on the mcyl.

Don't forget to route that line into the cabin via your bias valve..... that's what i shall be doing anyway!


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by Corky » Sun Feb 19, 2017 3:30 pm

reliant-reviver wrote:
Don't forget to route that line into the cabin via your bias valve..... that's what i shall be doing anyway!
Have you read this :-
"MSA Blue Book"

Brakes

10.7.2. Brake balance adjusters must not be available
for adjustment during running.


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by CNHSS1 » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:15 pm

Can be in the car, just not operable when strapped in. The rally boys often tywarp or lockwire in position so as not operable when competing


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Re: Converting SS1 Front Brakes to Single Line

Post by reliant-reviver » Mon Feb 20, 2017 9:14 am

That was the Question i was going to ask. A thanking you CNH.


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