FRONT HUB INNER BEARING OIL SEAL

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Pogle
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FRONT HUB INNER BEARING OIL SEAL

Post by Pogle » Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:54 pm

Hello Everyone I am new to the club but not new to car restorations.

I am posting this observation because I am concerned it is something someone might easily over look.

I recently dismantled my front wheel hub and front suspension on my 1977 SE6A. The inner wheel bearing oil seal consisted of 3 parts two of which were immediately obvious the third was not. Upon removal of the hub and bearings I could see the felt ring and the pressed steel retainer still on the hub behind the bearing, however on the stub axle was a hardened steel inner oil seal collar which initially looked like it was part of the shaft. however it slid off and I cable tied the collar, felt ring and retainer together for future reference. That was some weeks ago. Today I fitted the new bearings to the hub got out the new oil seal which came with the bearings TWO parts - felt ring and pressed steel retainer - no inner seal collar.

I have been using the Brooklands Books Reliant Scimitar Owners Workshop Manual that covers models 1968-79 probably already familiar with it. Well FIG 9.2 `Components of a front suspension and wheel hub` do not show this inner collar at all, only the two parts of the oil seal felt ring and retainer - no illustration or mention of the 3rd crucial part. it is not mentioned anywhere in the chapter.

I then went onto Graham Walker website and checked their parts catalogue and sure enough it is there on the exploded view of the hub SECTION B3/2 Front Suspension Part number 13 clearly marked, however if you scroll down to the parts list Section B3/1 you will find the parts numbers go 11, 12 then 14, 15. Oil Seal assembly , inner bearing is labelled as part no 14 when in fact it should be part number 13, the seal being 14 and the cup (retainer) part 15. Notice also part 13 the inner bearing does not have a long part number like all the other components - it is almost as if it does not exist.

My point is that I noticed this part and because I banded my oil seal together as 3 parts and referred to it when fitting the new one noticed the inner seal bearing and fitted it despite there being no mention of it in the workshop manual at all. Without this part in place the inner wheel bearing would be 2mm or so further in on the stub axle and cause all sorts of problems or even failure.

As an owners club that sells these books it might be wise to ask Brooklands Books to amend their manual to highlight this part isn`t shown or mentioned.

The collar on my stub axle initially did not move and for all intents and purposes looked like part of the shaft, only when cleaning did I realise it wasn`t when it came off, it could have fallen off at any point and had I not noticed and followed the manual I would have assembled it without it being there.

I know there are loads of you out there driving Scimitars who probably thinking I am making something about nothing, pay attention to when you dismantle something and make sure all the parts go back again, I agree but to someone new to restoring cars the time between dismantling and re-assembly could be quite a while, the fact that reference material, such as a manual is deficient and parts catalogue too, could lead to a serious problem.

Any how the inner bearing seal should have three parts but only comes with two - inner bearing seal (1st thing to go onto the stub axle) felt ring and a retaining plate.

If this has been pointed out before on this forum I apologise, but I couldn`t find it I feel it is important for future restorers to know so I have posted.

Best wishes Ian

Attached are photos of the Stub axle with the inner seal bearing in place, then removed and placed upside down next to the stub axle, then a photo of the stub axle minus the part
Attachments
20180708_191237.jpg
Stub axle with inner bearing oil seal inner bearing in place
20180708_191237.jpg (139.26 KiB) Viewed 261 times
20180708_191253.jpg
Stub axle with the oils seal inner part removed and next to it
20180708_191253.jpg (153.18 KiB) Viewed 261 times
20180708_191157.jpg
Stub axle without the inner oil seal inner bearing
20180708_191157.jpg (162.03 KiB) Viewed 261 times



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FRONT HUB INNER BEARING OIL SEAL

Post by ard126k » Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:58 pm

The innermost ring is listed in the Reliant parts book as 211184 - cup, inner bearing abutment. It's not really part of the oil seal and shouldn't wear out.

Alex.


1971 SE5 1977 SE6 1982 GTC

Pogle
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FRONT HUB INNER BEARING OIL SEAL

Post by Pogle » Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:34 pm

Hello Alex,
I agree with you that it is not really part of the oil seal, however its close proximity to the seal and the fact that it can come away with the felt ring, means it could easily be mistaken as part of the seal. Yes it is a very hard part and doesn`t wear out. You are correct that it is listed as part 211184 -cup inner bearing abutment - however it is only listed as such on the SE6B GTC parts list and not mentioned at all on the SE6/6A at least not on the Graham Walker site copy.

Both of mine are fine and will of course be refitted along with the new felt rings and retainer, just concerned me that such an important bearing part could potentially be overlooked because it is not properly listed in the parts catalogue for the SE6/6A.

Thanks for pointing that out though maybe next time I find something missing I will check the SE6B parts list as well.

Regards Ian.



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FRONT HUB INNER BEARING OIL SEAL

Post by Roger Pennington » Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:51 pm

There is another complication you haven't considered - AFAIK some cars don't have the separate collar, it is in fact cast into the upright. I'm more or less certain that the mulberry car is like that, from my recollection of changing the bearings a couple of years ago :)


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FRONT HUB INNER BEARING OIL SEAL

Post by Pogle » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:44 pm

Evening Roger
There are always little complications and nuances when restoring classic cars, I am fairly sure that the car I am currently restoring has never been dismantled before so pretty much everything I come across mechanically will have been as it was when the car was originally assembled. Had I not noticed this abutment ring during the dismantling I could have easily either lost it or not refitted it because of the missing references to it. As it happens everything is now going back together abutment and all and life is good hoping to have all the suspension and steering back on this week and the chassis back on its wheels and stored back in the garage beneath the supported body - leaving the gearbox and engine out for the moment to make the chassis easier to roll in and out whilst the underside of the car body is painted and prepared to re-uniting with the chassis.

Anyway putting this topic to bed now too many other things to be doing.

Regards Ian.



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FRONT HUB INNER BEARING OIL SEAL

Post by Roger Pennington » Wed Jul 11, 2018 2:48 pm

Yes, you're right about variations, though bearing in mind that I've owned the mulberry car since Jan 1983, I can be pretty certain it is still as original too :D .


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