Advice for a respray SE5a

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GTJoe72
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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by GTJoe72 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 2:43 am

Hi, total Newbie here. Recently took delivery of my 1973 SE5a which I am very pleased with. It was always going to need a full respray which I am lining up. I’m sure loads of you have been here before so I hope some useful advice will follow.

Don’t suppose someone who has done this has a helpful xl spreadsheet (or similar) of all the bits required?

Pretty sure I will need to replace rear window and front quarter light seals, and maybe the insert for the windscreen seal (is that supposed to be chromed ?) Bonnet sound insulation also needs swapping out.

Lots of other wee bits to do, but focusing on the big one first.

Thanks in advance.

Joe



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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by scimjim » Sat Jul 06, 2019 6:34 am

Welcome to the forum Joe :D

I expect Dave Speed might be best placed to comment as he's painted lots of Scimitars and is currently rebuilding one for himself. I find that the trouble with a good respray is you can't bring yourself to refit old trim to a shiny body and you end up replacing nearly everything :D


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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by GTJoe72 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 7:58 am

Thanks Jim... yes having been down this route before with another car I totally agree and am hoping to prepare a bit better this time 😉



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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by Don Ricardo » Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:01 pm

Why re-spray? I have started on that route, and stopped as I have discovered that the car has several different types of paint on it, so unless I go back to the gel coat, I have already come across reaction between these different paints while repairing the stress cracks in the body work. It has been suggested that I vinyl wrap the vehicle instead. This I am looking into, as I can get a colour match, and from the quotation I have it's going to be quite a bit cheaper, also the vinyl has a 10 year guarantee.



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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by AJL Electronics » Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:55 pm

Don Ricardo wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:01 pm
Why re-spray?
Because it is going to achieve a nice durable finish?
Don Ricardo wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:01 pm
I have started on that route, and stopped as I have discovered that the car has several different types of paint on it, so unless I go back to the gel coat, I have already come across reaction between these different paints while repairing the stress cracks in the body work.
That is because you have not consulted me or Speedy Dave about how to do it. We have been doing fibreglass painting for many years. The way it should be done is to strip it back as far as you can. Make sure the body is totally dried out and then give it two coats of Lechler 29107 epoxy primer. You then do your repairs and follow with two more coats. Then you can refinish as desired.
Don Ricardo wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:01 pm
It has been suggested that I vinyl wrap the vehicle instead. This I am looking into, as I can get a colour match, and from the quotation I have it's going to be quite a bit cheaper, also the vinyl has a 10 year guarantee.
It will also look appalling. Unless you prep. the body perfectly, every blemish will show through. If you are going to prep it to that level, you may as well paint it properly. Vinyl wrap doesn't last, doesn't take polish and looks like the cheapskate bodge that it is. 10 year warranty? I will give it five before it starts to peel. Your supplier will be long gone before a claim arises..


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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by scimmy_man » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:00 pm

fat bird in leggings was Daves quote on wrapping


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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by *JP* » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:13 pm

From what the OP says it seems like he wants to do the work himself?

I agree with what's said above about correct preparation and using the best modern materials,however these materials do not lend themselves to home diy use.Modern two pack materials demand careful use to avoid damaging your own health and possibly that of your neighbours.

I have dabbled in home spray work for nearly 50 years now, using cellulose based materials but I would not recommend such a system on an old fibre glass car.

Better to leave it to one of the experts.It won't be cheap but the car will look great and it's value will increase.People on here moan about the low value of Scimitars compared to other classics but it doesn't help when so many only look good when viewed from 10+ yards distant.



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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by AJL Electronics » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:50 pm

*JP* wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:13 pm
From what the OP says it seems like he wants to do the work himself?
Not a problem in the slightest. It shouldn't be approached lightly or with limited knowledge because it is a great deal of hard, dusty labour and frought with potential for a nice crop of blisters the first time that the sun comes out.

*JP* wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:13 pm
I agree with what's said above about correct preparation and using the best modern materials,however these materials do not lend themselves to home diy use.Modern two pack materials demand careful use to avoid damaging your own health and possibly that of your neighbours.
The term "2 pack" is a bit like "Hoover" in that it used generically and really tells you little. It actually comes from the German language which is why its abbreviation is 2K (for Komponent). All it means is that it has a base and a hardener, it doesn't mean it contains isocyanates. The place to find that crucial information is in the product's data and safety sheets.

In the case of Lechler 29107 and all epoxy primers that I am aware of, no isocyanates are used in its manufacture and so can be applied with standard PPE or even brushed on (not something I suggest for bodywork, just chassis etc).

*JP* wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:13 pm
I have dabbled in home spray work for nearly 50 years now, using cellulose based materials but I would not recommend such a system on an old fibre glass car.

Once the 29107 has been applied, it is inert and waterproof, so air drying paints will be perfectly OK as long as their limitations are understood.
*JP* wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:13 pm
Better to leave it to one of the experts.It won't be cheap but the car will look great and it's value will increase.People on here moan about the low value of Scimitars compared to other classics but it doesn't help when so many only look good when viewed from 10+ yards distant.
That is good advice but for someone who wants to have a go, get it to final epoxy primer, flat to 400 dry and hand it over to a bodyshop for final finishing if they will accept it. You may have to agree to a disclaimer on the warranty of course.
Last edited by AJL Electronics on Sat Jul 13, 2019 6:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.


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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by *JP* » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:23 pm

That's all very good information.

From what you say it is possible to use air drying type products over the right sort of base but,sadly for me and others brought up on the old cellulose type products,I have to acknowledge that the end result is rather soft and not that durable.

I suppose solvent basecoat could be used as long as it was topped by a two pack lacquer?



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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by AJL Electronics » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:45 pm

*JP* wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:23 pm
That's all very good information.

From what you say it is possible to use air drying type products over the right sort of base but,sadly for me and others brought up on the old cellulose type products,I have to acknowledge that the end result is rather soft and not that durable.

I suppose solvent basecoat could be used as long as it was topped by a two pack lacquer?
Modern single pack acrylics are not bad, although a proper 2K finish will always be best. Solvent or water based basecoat always has to be lacquered. You can use 1K lacquer of course, but 2K will be far more durable. Flash times are very important before lacquer, leave it too long and the lacquer will not bond.


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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by peter freeman » Sat Jul 13, 2019 6:04 pm

Did my Coupe with water based paint and found it very forgiving and much easier to apply than cellulose or twin pack - you still need to put lacquer on top though and I have used Max Meyer which I also find to be relatively easy to use. My previous attempts with twin pack and cellulose were shall we say were "not good" - to put it mildly.



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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by *JP* » Sat Jul 13, 2019 6:31 pm

peter freeman wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 6:04 pm
Did my Coupe with water based paint and found it very forgiving and much easier to apply than cellulose or twin pack - you still need to put lacquer on top though and I have used Max Meyer which I also find to be relatively easy to use. My previous attempts with twin pack and cellulose were shall we say were "not good" - to put it mildly.
Solvent basecoat is more forgiving than cellulose and dries quickly so not prone to collecting dirt.
Never tried water based.
I'll have to try two pack lacquer some time,only ever used one pack acrylic which is easy to use but still rather soft when dry.

Major jobs are too much for me nowadays,all I do is small jobs on my modern cars,e.g. scratched bumper or curbed alloy.



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Post by AJL Electronics » Sat Jul 13, 2019 6:38 pm

Water base dries by evaporation and takes a while. Airflow is used to dry it rather than absolute heat as solvent base would be. My engine bay took 40 mins or so to flash properly, solvent would be 10-15 minutes.


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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by AJL Electronics » Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:34 pm

One important point about prep.

Microblisters are a real pain on fibreglass. They are caused by two factors, the first is tiny imperfections in the surface which hold moisture. The second is the factory surfacer which is one big sponge. To eradicate microblisters, it is essential to eradicate all traces of of it and then dry out the bodywork thoroughly. Then once the first coats of 29107 are applied, only dry sanding should be done until the final finish has been applied. You should never see microblisters again.

Just to elucidate, they are not caused by 'Osmosis'. Look the word up, it has nothing to do with fibreglass resin whatever and everything to do with the passage of salts through a membrane. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osmosis


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Advice for a respray SE5a

Post by MikeyBikey » Sat Jul 13, 2019 10:04 pm

Hi, I did a full body restoration / repaint on my 5a with two pack but solid colour (burnt orange) . Bloody brilliant, did the prep myself and fortunantly a neighbour sprays boats so he did the final coats. worked out about £800 in materials but two pack is soo durable. I've dropped loads of brake fluid etc and it doesn't touch it. So i can vouch for the respray and yes, get a sprayer who konws what they are doing aka andy or dave. I personally would avoid a wrap. I had white plastic rondials on my sprint car and they bubbled extensively underneath but that might be an isolated issue. ???


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