SE6A Fuel Pump

Discuss and exchange views and technical information about our cars.

Moderators: scimjim, philhoward, erikscimitardemon, Roger Pennington, Lukeyboy46

bambam40
RSSOC Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:02 pm
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 1 time

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by bambam40 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 11:20 am

My car has been laid up for around 18 mths whilst it has been stripped and prepped for paint ( very slow process as "life" keeps getting in the way). I decided to try and start it yesterday on a whim just to run it up to temp and get oil all around etc.

About 8th tank of probably stale fuel so put around 2 gallons of fresh in. Turns over fine and didn't fire. Sprayed some Easi start down the carb and it fired up immediately but would only run whilst spraying.
I took the feed pipe of the carb and it is bone dry even after much starter churning and around 30 secs of the engine idling. Turned it over for some time more with the pipe in a jar and not even a dribble.
My question is do you guys think this is a defunct fuel pump or maybe an air lock? Is there a fuel filter in the system and if so where is it located?

Last question is it a good idea to change the old cam-driven pump to an electric one?

Thanks in advance for the usual barrage of learned advice.


SE6A O/D 1978
2005 Lexus GS300
2018 Mini Countryman Plug In Hybrid
2014 Porsche Boxster

User avatar
peter freeman
RSSOC Member
Posts: 9355
Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 12:12 pm
Location: Newcastle
Has thanked: 9 times
Been thanked: 308 times
Contact:

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by peter freeman » Sat Jun 09, 2018 11:37 am

Electric will prime the carb whereas the mechanical one will rely on the engine turning. Not a problem if you use the car every day but if you only use it every couple of weeks you risk the battery running out of power. Try blowing into the pipe to see if the fuel in the tank bubbles - if not then you have a pipe problem. The 6B's have a filter next to the tank the 6's I have had have a filter in the engine bay - not an original fit though.



User avatar
scimjim
RSSOC Member
Posts: 35642
Joined: Sun Oct 01, 2006 10:08 pm
Location: Gloucester
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 810 times

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by scimjim » Sat Jun 09, 2018 12:13 pm

Possibly dried fuel?


Jim King

Current: SE5 (8Ball), TI SS1 (snotty), 1600 SS1 (G97), 1600 SS1 (C686CCR), 2.5TD SE5a (diesel 5a), 6 x random other SS1s.
Previous: SE5, 3 x SE5a, 2 x SE6a, 3 x SE6b, GTC, 2.9i GTC, 3 x 1600 SS1, 1300 SS1, Mk1 Ti Sabre, Mk1.5 CVH Sabre
Chief mechanic for: 1400 K series SS1 (Megan3), 1400 CVH EFi SS1 (Grawpy), Sabre/MX5 auto (The Flying Broomstick),
1300 SS1 (Number One) & Sarah's coupe.
CURE THE FAULT - NOT THE SYMPTOMS

Oldconn
RSSOC Member
Posts: 1491
Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2013 1:09 pm
Location: Haute-Saône,France
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 77 times

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by Oldconn » Sat Jun 09, 2018 12:31 pm

Possibly a diaphragm valve in the pump gummed-up. Anelectric pump is a good idea IMHO, as Peter says it will work as soon as you turn the key without having to churn the motor while the carb fills up. A facet silver-top will be fine for a standard engine, best fitted near the tank , with a dedicated wire , a fuse fuse and a crash-switch (ie: an inertia switch which cuts the supply in the event of a crash), loads of them available on e-bay.


"When I grow up, I want to be me"
-Kermit Weeks
Current: SE6A; 998 Mini.Previous: Morris Minor,Ford8, Cortinas Mk1 &2,MG Midget 1932,Morgan 3W 1934,Lagonda Rapier,Honda S800, Austin Maxi,Citroen GSA, Riley ElfMk2,Peugeot 505,Rover 420 SDI

bambam40
RSSOC Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:02 pm
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 1 time

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by bambam40 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 4:57 pm

Thanks all. I will check out the lines but think I will go electric in due course.


SE6A O/D 1978
2005 Lexus GS300
2018 Mini Countryman Plug In Hybrid
2014 Porsche Boxster

User avatar
AJL Electronics
RSSOC Member
Posts: 7419
Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:49 pm
Location: Gloucester
Has thanked: 42 times
Been thanked: 206 times
Contact:

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by AJL Electronics » Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:43 pm

Favourite is perished rubber hoses at the tank end. They then suck air instead of fuel.


Yes, we can mend your Scimitar!
Order your Scimitar parts any hour of the day at http://www.classicmicrocars.com (member's discounts).

Fancy a holiday in Gael, France? http://www.ianrhu.com

There is no point trying to teach a pig to sing. It doesn't work and it annoys the pig.

Johniewalshe
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:55 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by Johniewalshe » Sat Jun 09, 2018 11:23 pm

Hi,
I recently started a 6 that had been sitting for years.

First I cleaned filter in pump and the carb. Then I used a drill driven pump, and pump would work, to pull fuel as far as the pump, it took surprising long. Then refitted pipes, pulled feed one of the carb and again used pump to pull fuel to the carb. Started very easily after that.

It would have taken a hell of alot of cranking to achieve this.



bambam40
RSSOC Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:02 pm
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 1 time

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by bambam40 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:42 pm

OK so the mechanical pump was busted and is now junked and the hole blanked off.
Looking at the various electric pumps available on a well known internet Auction site there are many different variations. Does it matter how powerful the new pump is?
There are some shown which are recommended for Fuel Injection cars, would these suit the SE6A? I'm assuming excess fuel delivery just returns to the tank?
Many mention a "pre-Filter" which I assume means an in-line filter between the tank and pump?


SE6A O/D 1978
2005 Lexus GS300
2018 Mini Countryman Plug In Hybrid
2014 Porsche Boxster

User avatar
scimjim
RSSOC Member
Posts: 35642
Joined: Sun Oct 01, 2006 10:08 pm
Location: Gloucester
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 810 times

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by scimjim » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:54 pm

Fuel injection pump operate at much higher pressures - you need one made for carbs.


Jim King

Current: SE5 (8Ball), TI SS1 (snotty), 1600 SS1 (G97), 1600 SS1 (C686CCR), 2.5TD SE5a (diesel 5a), 6 x random other SS1s.
Previous: SE5, 3 x SE5a, 2 x SE6a, 3 x SE6b, GTC, 2.9i GTC, 3 x 1600 SS1, 1300 SS1, Mk1 Ti Sabre, Mk1.5 CVH Sabre
Chief mechanic for: 1400 K series SS1 (Megan3), 1400 CVH EFi SS1 (Grawpy), Sabre/MX5 auto (The Flying Broomstick),
1300 SS1 (Number One) & Sarah's coupe.
CURE THE FAULT - NOT THE SYMPTOMS

bambam40
RSSOC Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:02 pm
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 1 time

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by bambam40 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:11 pm

Thanks for that info Jim. I suppose the high pressure is to activate the injectors? I will source one designed for Carbs. With regards to the filter, should it be placed prior to the pump or just before the carbs? or doesn't it matter?


SE6A O/D 1978
2005 Lexus GS300
2018 Mini Countryman Plug In Hybrid
2014 Porsche Boxster

User avatar
scimjim
RSSOC Member
Posts: 35642
Joined: Sun Oct 01, 2006 10:08 pm
Location: Gloucester
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 810 times

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by scimjim » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:26 pm

A pre-filter goes before the electric pump. Up to you if you want another filter before the carbs.

As standard, the 6b/GTC had a filter between the tank and mechanical pump and the injection cars (K series and Nissan) got filters between the pump and fuel rail.


Jim King

Current: SE5 (8Ball), TI SS1 (snotty), 1600 SS1 (G97), 1600 SS1 (C686CCR), 2.5TD SE5a (diesel 5a), 6 x random other SS1s.
Previous: SE5, 3 x SE5a, 2 x SE6a, 3 x SE6b, GTC, 2.9i GTC, 3 x 1600 SS1, 1300 SS1, Mk1 Ti Sabre, Mk1.5 CVH Sabre
Chief mechanic for: 1400 K series SS1 (Megan3), 1400 CVH EFi SS1 (Grawpy), Sabre/MX5 auto (The Flying Broomstick),
1300 SS1 (Number One) & Sarah's coupe.
CURE THE FAULT - NOT THE SYMPTOMS

bambam40
RSSOC Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:02 pm
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 1 time

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by bambam40 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:12 pm

Ok guys some more problems here. I purchased an electric pump which is rated for carbs and should deliver 95-115 litres/hr. I have mounted this near the tank inside the rear chassis rail. Checked the flow into a bottle up by the engine and it seems to be pumping well (although I have no idea what 95-115 lph looks like!).
I have fitted a fuel filter just before the carb and wired the pump into a switched ignition line using a relay and protective fuse.
When I turn on the ignition I can see the filter filling up to about half way but no further. The engine starts and ticks over nice and smoothly. After about 30 seconds the engine dies. It also dies if I try to raise the revs past idle for any length of time. It will not re start straight away but after around 10-20 seconds it will re start with the same result every time.

I'm guessing this is a fuel problem and, remembering the car hasn't run for around 18 months I have dismantled the carb and cleaned everything including the jets.
Do you think the pump is not delivering enough or does this sound electrical like a coil breaking down?
Maybe I have made an error fitting the pump.

Any help appreciated.


SE6A O/D 1978
2005 Lexus GS300
2018 Mini Countryman Plug In Hybrid
2014 Porsche Boxster

bambam40
RSSOC Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:02 pm
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 1 time

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by bambam40 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 5:59 pm

Didn't mention, both flow and return fuel lines have been blown thru with compressed air so no blockages.


SE6A O/D 1978
2005 Lexus GS300
2018 Mini Countryman Plug In Hybrid
2014 Porsche Boxster

Johniewalshe
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:55 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by Johniewalshe » Sat Jun 23, 2018 8:23 pm

Is your filter just a filter or is it a filter regulator. If it is a regulator type you may need to adjust the pressure. Using a pressure gauge you should have 4psi with the engine running.
Also check the filter going into the new pump, it could be already blocked, as the car has been sitting a while there may be crap in the tank.

There is a filter gauze at the carb also, get it for crap.



bambam40
RSSOC Member
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:02 pm
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 1 time

SE6A Fuel Pump

Post by bambam40 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 8:35 pm

Thanks for the reply.
Its just a plain universal filter so no regulator. Didn't see any Gauze when I stripped the carb. I pulled the feed pipe off the carb and out it in a 500ml bottle which filled in around20 seconds.
I have also tried now without the filter and the results are the same.


SE6A O/D 1978
2005 Lexus GS300
2018 Mini Countryman Plug In Hybrid
2014 Porsche Boxster

Post Reply

Return to “General Technical Discussion”